Liberal Cartoons - Monte Wolverton Needs Your Support === [00:00:00] Daryl Cagle: Hey everybody. I'm Daryl Cagle, and this is the Caglecast from Cagle.comand Kegel cartoons. We're a newspaper syndicate and we have around 500 plus papers and we have about 60 cartoonists that we represent . We put out about 120, 130 cartoons a week, and we have some great cartoonists, brilliant cartoonists, and, one of the most brilliant is here with me today. I'm here with, Monty Wolverton. Thanks for joining me, Monty. [00:00:30] Monte Wolverton: Thanks, Darrell. Good [00:00:32] Daryl Cagle: to be here. We're gonna have, A conversation with Monty and looking at a bunch of his cartoons, and he's, featured cartoonists on our site now as, we're trying to do, crowdfunding for Monty. You know, as newspapers die. So dyes are only paying clients, for the odd thing that we do. So, uh, something that we're gonna try to do on Cagle.com is be, uh, kind of a, a Patreon for editorial cartoonists to, see if the fans can help support [00:01:00] the cartoonists and keep them drawing as our, our clients fade away because we don't want our art form to fade away. And I think editorial cartoonists are a very important part of the public debate. Uh, especially guys like Monty, who is a great progressive voice. A strong voice on the left, and those, those voices are gonna be the first to die off, I'm afraid as newspapers, uh, fade away favoring the middle of the road cartoons and the conservative cartoons uh, what do you think about all this monkey? Well, [00:01:31] Monte Wolverton: I think it's, uh, kind of to be expected, the progression of things, businesses change all the time and we have to move with the, with the dynamics. And I think that's what we're doing here. Oh, look, here's one of my cartoons. There you go. [00:01:47] Daryl Cagle: Uh, it's Putin [00:01:49] Monte Wolverton: and you're gonna read, [00:01:50] Daryl Cagle: and we've got rockets falling all over and they're falling on Ukraine. And it's really a, visually interesting cartoon, with all the rockets raining down. Putin says it's not too [00:02:00] much, is. . [00:02:02] Monte Wolverton: Yeah. This, this was fun. It's kind of similar to one that I did about moa Mark Kfi, uh, quite a few years ago. That what would it have been 10 years ago or so? Probably, probably more, except in his case the rockets were falling on him. But, but who doesn't like visuals of a lot of rockets falling? Um, this [00:02:24] Daryl Cagle: is a nice strong visual. It, it's strong. I like this. Uh, you're making not one of your usual. L liberal cartoons, but, uh, it's, uh, [00:02:33] Monte Wolverton: it's a lot's particularly liberal. Uh, he's making a sarcastic comment. It's, it's probably insensitive. That's the kind of guy he is. And, but, but what's, what's more insensitive than, than, uh, raining rockets down on top of people. [00:02:50] Daryl Cagle: That's true. Now this is a liberal cartoon and, uh, that's, I think that's kind of sad because why the heck should this be a liberal cartoon? [00:03:00] It's only because it's the conservatives that are, are trying to ban books. So you've got a cartoon that says books big at the top. You can ban 'em, you can burn 'em, you can bury 'em, but you can't beat 'em. And big pile of books. . That's, uh, that's a sad commentary monkey. [00:03:17] Monte Wolverton: It's, it's sad. Uh, you know, there's a guy named, uh, Jason Stanley, who wrote a great book called How Fascism Works, and he points out in there that the banning of books, the suppression of information, the suppression of a free. is, uh, an early sign of incipient fascism, and this is what's happening in the country. We're not burning them yet, but we're, we're banning them. But I thought I would take a positive approach here. And, just, uh, I'm just saying basically that you really can't suppress books because if you burn one, if you throw one away, if you put it in the incinerator or. uh, you know, run it down the garbage disposal, uh, which might [00:04:00] clog your drain. Um, then there's another copy somewhere that somebody's gonna come up with. So you can't really get rid of books as much as you might try. [00:04:11] Daryl Cagle: I just find it ironic that this is, uh, a cartoon from the left. But it is, that's where, where we live. Okay, here's another one. Uh, this one shows three unattractive elephants. One is speaking to the others. The headline is defunding public education. And the elephant says to his brethren, and when our plan is complete, only the wealthy will be able to afford education. Finally, the roof raff will be under our control. [00:04:43] Monte Wolverton: Monty. So yes, this is, I, I just love drawing these kinds of elephants. They're kind of cuddly and kind of rubbery. With that texture that I use there, So you do [00:04:55] Daryl Cagle: have a very interesting, uh, distinctive style with, uh, all [00:05:00] the rubbery and the texture. [00:05:01] Monte Wolverton: They're fun to draw and I used to not put tusks in, and now I started putting tusks in for some reason. Anyway, the g o p, they continue to chip away and chip away and chip away at, uh, education or funding for education until, uh, eventually. The idea I think is that the public schools will be so bad that nobody will wanna send their kids. And then, the only people that will send their kids, there are people who can't afford the private schools. The privilege can afford private schools and, the majority of citizens will be suppressed. I think that's the plan here. I just can't help but think that's the plan. [00:05:42] Daryl Cagle: This is the kind of cartoon that I would expect to be popular on your social media and. Uh, reprinted in newspapers at [00:05:53] Monte Wolverton: all? I believe it was. I believe I don't, was it reprinted? [00:05:57] Daryl Cagle: I didn't, I didn't check the stats on this one, [00:06:00] but, uh, you know, cartoons that are, uh strongly Republican bashing from the left. Yeah. Ted not to get much ink. Because uh, you know, editors like to be middle of the road. They like to do things that nobody's gonna disagree with but on your social media, your fans are all progressive like you, and these are the cartoons that they like best. The harder you're bashing the Republicans Yeah. The more they love it. [00:06:23] Monte Wolverton: Yeah. I got a, like a lot of likes, uh, for this one on on. as I [00:06:28] Daryl Cagle: recall. That's one of the things that I think is interesting is we're we're trying to do the crowdfunding for the artists. Um, what an interesting difference it will make in. in the work of editorial cartoonists if their client is their fans rather than the newspaper publishers. Uh, because the fans want the strong hard-hitting cartoons that cartoonists love to draw, and cartoonists are constantly frustrated by the newspaper. Uh, editors who, uh, who want the Nam b pamby don't take any position [00:07:00] cartoons. We may see a change in the whole nature of editorial cartooning if we can. Get support from the fans instead of the newspapers. This could be a very good thing. Well, it would make the cartoonists happy. Uh, we're in a kind of a funny situation where, uh, our traditional audience has, uh, actually it's the, I don't know, there's so much the audience, but it's the editors who want to not get any letters that disagree is their circulations plummet cartoonists love the hard hitting cartoons, and our fans who tend to agree with us love the hard hitting cartoons. And uh, uh, our clients. I do not. And that's just, uh, it's very frustrating and something that may change, as the newspapers go away, and maybe it's our fans that support us and, even more eyeballs are on our work because we've got the internet. So true. Well, I'm hoping that that, may [00:08:00] be true with our crowdfunding. For you, Monty, you're the first one that we're trying this. It's an individual cartoonist on kegel.com, and I'm hoping that your fans and, uh, people who, uh, appreciate your point of view. I don't expect many, uh, conservatives would make a contribution to you. But, um, those of like mind, consider contributing to Monty, because we, we want to keep Monty. Drawing as the newspapers go away. And, uh, you know, you can make that possible by going to Cagle.com/wolverton and, and give money a couple bucks and, uh, keep the liberal cartoons coming. [00:08:40] Monte Wolverton: And gratefully, we acknowledge your contribution and thank you for your support, . [00:08:45] Daryl Cagle: Okay, uh, here's another one. This is couple and they're watching Biden on TV, signing a 1.7 trillion spending bill, and the says you had another government shut down [00:09:00] narrowly averted. Oh, the drama. [00:09:03] Monte Wolverton: This is one of those, uh, uh, a couple watching the news and making commentary on it. Cartoons, which seems to be a nice, uh, nice little device. The cartoon is really not about the 1.7. Trillion dollar spending bill, I like to call it a spending bill. You know, it's just a bill, which was signed by God's grace. But uh, not without the big idiotic, uh, debt ceiling drama that goes on and on and on, and will happen again later this year and next year and the year after until they changed that, uh, that stupid law. So that's kind of what I'm saying. Or what the, what the couple is saying. I guess. [00:09:47] Daryl Cagle: Good for a lot of cartoons. Bad for everybody though. Yeah. Um I draw a lot of couple watching TV cartoons too, because, uh, actually it's, it's a cheap cartoonist trick and it, it lets us draw on [00:10:00] any subject without having to worry about how to draw that subject. [00:10:02] Monte Wolverton: Well, yeah. It is, it [00:10:03] Daryl Cagle: is a cheap trick and when I do it, I draw a point of view from the back of the television so I don't have to draw what's on the screen. So, I am certainly lazier than you. [00:10:15] Monte Wolverton: I could have done that, but you know, in this case you had to kind of had to show Joe signing the bill kind of , so that works that way. Yeah. Yeah. That would've, that would've been a lot easier to just do a. . Yeah. But then I would've had to draw the cords and stuff that hook up the, the tv. And that's . [00:10:33] Daryl Cagle: Yeah, I do that. Yeah. Uh, okay, so here's the mental hospital, the asylum for the fiscally demented. And the crazy Republican elephants are all in their straight jackets, uh, looking crazy and demented, and the doctors are standing there saying, okay, time for your medications, Monty. What the, the heck is going on? Well, [00:10:56] Monte Wolverton: this was about, um, Biden's, uh, comment [00:11:00] that the g o p is fiscally demented, or at least has some kind of cognitive dissonance about fiscal matters. Uh, they're So [00:11:10] Daryl Cagle: this is a cartoon based on a Biden quote. It [00:11:13] Monte Wolverton: is, yes. They seem, they seem to have forgotten that they, that they, uh, cut revenue, uh, a few years. And now, now we have a giant debt, which is the cause of the giant debt. I wanted to draw what, uh, being fiscally demented looks like. And it looks exactly like this. , I've seen it many times. , some of my friends , they look like this. It with the absence of the trunk. Maybe, you [00:11:42] Daryl Cagle: know, I should add money. You have a very distinctive style and it's very reminiscent of your father, who was a great, uh, and famous cartoonist, uh, cartooning historical figure. Basil Wolverton was one of the founding gang of Idiots and Mad Magazine. [00:12:00] And, uh, it's, it's fascinating that you're a chip off the old. [00:12:05] Monte Wolverton: Well, I, when I, when I started off doing, comic strips and stuff in college, it wasn't exactly the same way. But then later on I started kind of picking up my dad's, uh technique and style and all the, all the little lines and all the, the stippling and, and stuff, which, which takes, takes a lot of time. But, uh, in fact, an editor once, told my father, he said, uh, you cover up your lack of talent with all those little. . I don't know if this is true in his case, but it's probably true in my case. And here's, here's misinformation. [00:12:38] Daryl Cagle: Misinformation. So you've got a, another ugly Republican elephant with his, uh, [00:12:43] Monte Wolverton: big, I think he's cute. Isn't he cute? He's cute. Look at his cute little tusks. . Okay. [00:12:49] Daryl Cagle: Okay. He's a cute Republican elephant and he's, he's got his, uh, trunk sticking out, saying misinformation and hanging on at his signs. Whitewash black history, QAN on [00:13:00] stolen election, immigration, voting rights. Um, good, good looking and very clear, you know, editorial cartoonists like signs and [00:13:08] Monte Wolverton: labels. Signs and labels. Oh, these are all subjects that, that are. I don't wanna say hack need subjects, but, uh, stuff that stuff that we do every day. So this, this comes as, no, it's not a new thing, but it's perhaps it's a new way. I've never seen anybody take the trunk and do this with it. And, uh, and did you know Darrell, that there are 14 segments? 14 segments in an elephant's trunk? . There are 14 letters in the word misinformation. Coincidence? Is it a coincidence? [00:13:43] Daryl Cagle: That's fascinating. So you based this cartoon on Elephant Anatomy? [00:13:50] Monte Wolverton: No, that's, that's just misinformation. You could more be more critical in your thinking, Darryl, I think. I think you do. Yeah. [00:13:59] Daryl Cagle: Okay. [00:14:00] Very good. Monty, this next one, uh, is the old man in the hospital. He's got, uh, I should add that I explain all of these cartoons because this is also an audio podcast and people are listening to this and not knowing what the pictures are. If you don't. If you wanna look at the pictures, you can come to our Cagle cast.com site. Go to my blog@darylCagle.com, uh, where I will post the cartoons. And you can also go to, Cagle.com/wolverton, which is Monty's, uh, fundraising landing page that I hope you go to most, and that will show you an archive of all of Monty's latest cartoons. And, Monty will talk about, uh, what he's doing and why it's great to support, uh, a liberal cartoonist as the liberal cartoonist will be the first in our profession to die as newspapers go away. Um, so I am reading these cartoons for those of you that are listening to the audio podcast. Uh, and if you wanna see the cartoons that are easy to find, and, uh, you can also subscribe to our video podcast. And then you don't have to chase after the [00:15:00] cartoons. Old man in the hospital. He's got the bag of blood, uh, going into his arm. He's got the beeping machine. He's looking at his bill and he says, gasp. And he looks like he's about to die. And, the caption is usa arguably the only wealthy nation that doesn't make certain all it citizens have affordable healthcare. [00:15:22] Monte Wolverton: Well, he could, he could be an old guy. I think he's really only in his thirties. He's just had a hard. , uh, and lost all his teeth, which reminds me of, [00:15:30] Daryl Cagle: of cartoonists. You know, we're all old guys. Almost all the cartoonists are over 60. And, uh, you know, almost all the the newspaper readers are also over 60, so we are drawing for a like group, but we do get a lot of criticism for not being diverse and not having younger people in the profession. And, that is frustrating. But, I think kind of understandable, the young people are not really, uh eager to get [00:16:00] into a field where you have older people drawing for older people. We do get a lot of criticism for that and we do get a lot of, unsolicited submissions from people over 60 and not from young people. And that is, uh, you know, it is, uh, frustrating, but understandable. You have some comments [00:16:17] Monte Wolverton: on. People are putting off healthcare, older people are putting off healthcare. Younger people are putting off healthcare, uh, because they can't afford it, because they can't afford the insurance. And then things get worse. And, uh, and then they have to take out a loan or sell our house to afford major, major stuff. And what if they don't? What if they don't have a. look at, look at this guy. Look at, look at the way his, uh, his EKG looks up there. It's terrible. It's because he, that is [00:16:51] Daryl Cagle: a terrible ekg. Yes, it is. I might point out that younger people tend not to think about and worry about healthcare so much as older, older people. [00:17:00] They don't. And, in their, uh, publications or the web stuff that they visit, they tend not to see much discussion of the issue. [00:17:09] Monte Wolverton: Well until they, until they need it. My comment to to young people would be, well, it's coming for you. So it's an issue. [00:17:21] Daryl Cagle: it is issue. It's a serious issue. Okay, here's the g o p ugly elephant, uh, cute elephant. And, uh, he's giving a presentation and on his, his. Paper, Flipboard, the paper is blank and the caption is the g o P reveals its plan to stop inflation. And of course there is no plan because the paper is [00:17:46] Monte Wolverton: blank. , there's no plan. The paper is ba blank. Uh, it, it could be argued that, neither does the, neither do Democrats have a plan to stop inflation. But that's [00:18:00] largely because inflation is caused by worldwide economic forces and not, and not just, uh, politics, but the g o. , uh, likes that because it can be used as a lenon for, for Biden it likes inflation. [00:18:17] Daryl Cagle: So, uh, another cartoon that your readers would like Ed, yet? The newspaper editors probably would not simply because it takes a position, [00:18:27] Monte Wolverton: it does take a position and I, I thought newspaper editors would, would probably buy this one, but I don't, I don't think they did so much. [00:18:36] Daryl Cagle: Okay. Here's Lady Justice and she's got her sword and she's chasing after Trump, who we know because he's got his red tie. She says, you'll never escape. I can smell your tanning spray. [00:18:49] Monte Wolverton: Yeah. Well, justice is eventually going to, uh, catch up, uh, to, to Mr. Trump. One issue that I faced with this was, uh, this is a statue. [00:19:00] You know, it's a statue of justice. It's a personification. So should I, should I do it as a statue with gray skin? That looked kind of weird. Or is it a, a humanesque, uh, sort of entity? I chose the Humanesque version because it's a little more. So that's, [00:19:18] Daryl Cagle: that's a, well, I also think of justice as having one boob hanging out. And uh, you know, that's one of those taboos for us too, that we get a lot of complaints from the European cartoonists, uh, hahaha. You Americans cannot draw such things, and we actually can't because, of course you can draw whatever you want, but if you drew it, nobody would print it. So that's another source of frustration for us that makes the French Callis, uh, prudes. [00:19:46] Monte Wolverton: Uh, yeah, I don't know if this is, uh, exactly the shape of the justice statue, but I thought I handled it and, a good taste. I don't know if it's a charm. I have to ask a Frenchman. Yeah. [00:19:59] Daryl Cagle: Uh, [00:20:00] I should say we go to a editorial cartooning convention. I think it's the best editorial cartooning convention in the world every year in France. And, you're one of the regulars there and, the French are just, it's just a wonderful place to go where they really appreciate editorial cartoons. Um, yes, I love going to the convention sa you go [00:20:21] Monte Wolverton: somewhere where you're, where you're truly appreci. [00:20:26] Daryl Cagle: Here people tend to hate us. At least we hear more from those people. [00:20:31] Monte Wolverton: Yeah. We're so divisive. You know, look at me, I'm [00:20:35] Daryl Cagle: divisive. All you know, uh, the biggest newspaper chain in America, Ginette, which, uh, not long ago, had close to 500 papers. Decided to drop all editorial cartoons in all their papers because, The editorial cartoons are divisive. That's a terrible but uh, illustrative story of what's happening with newspapers. Now, [00:20:57] Monte Wolverton: actually, we're not divisive. [00:21:00] We may do some divisive things, but we're trying. , at least I am, to get people to pull back and take a broader view and laugh a little at the stuff that's happening and not take it so seriously. [00:21:16] Daryl Cagle: There were the years of the Trump administration where cartoonists were drawing, I would say a majority of cartoons were about Trump and they just didn't get printed because editors would not print cartoons about Trump and. Recall the frustration among cartoonists, you, among them. Me, we wanted to draw Trump and you know, you're drawing it only for yourself because it's just not gonna get printed. [00:21:41] Monte Wolverton: That's why I, I took to, uh, putting Trump slightly off, out of the frame and a lot of cartoons because all you gotta Do you think that helped? Yeah. All you gotta, I don't know. All you gotta have is a red tie, . I know it's [00:21:53] Daryl Cagle: Trump. Well that certainly makes 'em easier [00:21:56] Monte Wolverton: to. It does. Yeah. And that, [00:22:00] [00:22:00] Daryl Cagle: okay, so this next cartoon has the header, holiday scammers dream victim, and the nu looking nerd says, oh boy, a free smart tv. All I have to do is give them my credit card information and social security number to cover the shipping. . [00:22:21] Monte Wolverton: That's, that's, that's very good characterization. Uh, unfortunately there are plenty of vulnerable people like this, uh, out there who keep scammers in business. A lot of, I think [00:22:32] Daryl Cagle: particularly among the elderly audience of newspapers, [00:22:35] Monte Wolverton: that's just exactly what I was gonna say. Probably my age and older . But here, I, I didn't paint him as, an older person. I used one of my, one of my characters. I like to reuse Charact. . This is my wide-eyed, earnest, naive character. Uh, I think I used him as a cult member or something once, but, uh, I've used this guy [00:23:00] a number of times before and he seems to work here, and I thought, you know, this would be a nice public service thing to draw people's attention to the fact that, you need to think twice when somebody calls you and [00:23:11] Daryl Cagle: asks. And I do enjoy all your crosshatching and you know, very often, Monty, you draw hair that looks like it came out out of a Play-Doh extrusion mold. [00:23:21] Monte Wolverton: Yes. Y yeah. . Yeah, I do . I don't know how else to do it. . [00:23:30] Daryl Cagle: Okay. Next cartoon couple are looking at, uh, two burning fires of social media and crypto, and the man says, what's that? Arson, terrorist, insurrection of Russian missile. And, uh, lady, he says, no, just natural socioeconomic forces at work. [00:23:49] Monte Wolverton: That's, that's good. It almost sounded like it was out my outta money. Python. Um, oh, uh, yeah. Here's, here's another case of a couple commenting on the news [00:24:00] and, except they're not looking at the television. They're looking at, some, uh, [00:24:05] Daryl Cagle: some burning signs, which makes sense for us. Editorial cartoonists, cuz we do so many labels and. [00:24:12] Monte Wolverton: Labels and signs, and then smoke and stuff. Smoke and fire are always in the news, so you can kind of play off of that. And uh, and I think this, this one got fairly good results. If I recall correctly, even it w in newspapers, it's not, it's not really partisan. It's, uh, yeah, it's not, not [00:24:31] Daryl Cagle: really left or right. And then when the news is about, uh, burning social media and burning crypto editors like that. So here's some more burning. The header is welcome to the Epoch of Fire, and the city is on fire with, uh, the devil in front. And the devil says, I thought it was what you wanted. I mean, based on what you have done to the environment. But anyway, you'll get used to it. [00:24:56] Monte Wolverton: Yeah. Here's another character. I, I've used the [00:25:00] devil character a lot and I have this one devil that I do. , what he's suggesting here that's different I think is, is that we're really getting collectively what we deserve. Unfortunately, that's not exactly the way it works. The people on the bottom of the economic ladder are getting the brunt of stuff and the people on the top, well, they can always get in their private jet and fly away from the fire. But perhaps that's the subject of another cartoon. Good looking [00:25:26] Daryl Cagle: city on [00:25:27] Monte Wolverton: fire. Yeah, city on fire. It's not really burning, is it? The fire could be behind the city, but in any case, it's coming up on the city. Yeah, it's probably getting warm in those buildings there. [00:25:38] Daryl Cagle: Yeah. Yeah. All right. This one, the header says, A gun violence victim speaks from the afterlife. Your thoughts and prayers and $4 will get me a cup of coffee. Now go past some real gun control [00:25:51] Monte Wolverton: laws. Uh, yeah, this, this one disturbed me as I, as I did it, and, and I, [00:26:00] I kinda, she's a victim and [00:26:01] Daryl Cagle: she's dead, and she's an a angel. She's, [00:26:03] Monte Wolverton: I hoped it disturbed everyone. The sort of, the sort of irony, I think that's irony. I don't know. Let's assume for the sake of argument there's an afterlife and, uh, and that, uh, it's limited to Homo sapien. and uh, which go back about 200,000 years. And so, uh, [00:26:21] Daryl Cagle: then you figure, so there's no doggies in [00:26:23] Monte Wolverton: heaven. Well, I think there's gonna be ducks in heaven, but this is just for the sake of argument. So, uh, you figure about 110 billion, that's what they say, 110 billion homo sapiens have lived in the last two th a hundred thousand, uh, 200,000 years. And you figure a homicide rate, uh, homicide, world homicide rate is. 1%, which sounds small right now, but it's probably higher. Um, uh, let's say 2%. So that means at least 2 billion people in the afterlife are victims of homicide and, agreeing with her and maybe [00:27:00] more if you count war as homicide. It's a lot of, a lot of people who have, who have died and are sort of, uh, um, Whether or not you believe in afterlife, they're, they're condemning us for not doing something about it. So that's, that's what I'm trying to get across there. [00:27:21] Daryl Cagle: Well, very good. And uh, unfortunately, that one is also a very liberal cartoon. Hmm. , this one, Monty, is interesting because this is the most popular cartoon you've ever drawn in your many years with Kegel cartoons. Take a step back and say, Why is this your most popular cartoon? This is, a skip loader pushing a house off of, a cliff, a lovely rocky cliff. And, uh, it says tipping point question mark. And the sign pointing at it says, rising mortgage rates, rising home prices, rising construction [00:28:00] costs, low inventory. This just seems to be what editors really wanted to say. I think of your work as being so, uh, hard hitting and distinctive and, uh this is, uh, you know, this is, uh, middle of the road newspaper, cartoon that is not, uh not your kind of thing, except those rocks are wonderful. Yeah. [00:28:23] Monte Wolverton: Is that, is that, isn't that funny? It, there's, there's, uh, three reasons that people, that this might have been success. , uh, editors like bulldozers, that could be a reason. , uh, people are concerned or editors believe that people are concerned about housing, which they are. Housing prices going, going up, and about to to [00:28:46] Daryl Cagle: crash. Well, that's a major part of the newspapers. They all have big real estate sections. They all cover the housing and money stuff. Uh, in disproportion. [00:28:55] Monte Wolverton: I don't think it's, uh, popularity had anything to do with any of those reasons, though. I think it's people [00:29:00] like gravel. People Like gravel. Yeah. That's great. Gravel. That's the, uh, that's the thing there. It's, uh, prominently features, gravel. It's down [00:29:09] Daryl Cagle: to earth. I think you really took joy in doing the gravel [00:29:12] Monte Wolverton: on this. I did. I took great joy in. It took about, uh, it took a couple of days just to do the gravel. [00:29:19] Daryl Cagle: Yeah. This is your second most popular cartoon ever, and you've been with us like 15 years, Monty. Um, your number one and number two cartoon of the whole 15 years has been 15 years. [00:29:32] Monte Wolverton: It seems like it's been longer than that, I think to 98 time just crawls by, is it 1998? Is that 15 years? It is, as a matter of fact, no, wait a minute. 98 . That's [00:29:45] Daryl Cagle: funny. That's 25 years. We, we hadn't started yet in 1998. Oh, okay. We started in 2001. [00:29:52] Monte Wolverton: That was the, that was the preliminary things. [00:29:56] Daryl Cagle: Um, so this is Monty's second most popular cartoon, [00:30:00] and the firemen are, uh, pointing their hose at the hospital that's on fire and smoking. And, uh, one fireman says there's no fire. It's just healthcare workers burning [00:30:10] Monte Wolverton: out, healthcare workers burning out. Uh, one of my neighbors did just that, uh, she stayed in the, in the business, but she, she was. She was working in a, in an er, in a covid ward, and it just, uh, it just got to her because, uh, those people are not compensated. Our most expensive system in the world is unable to cope with the vicissitudes of epidemics and pandemics and er workers take the, take the brunt with high stress and long hours. So that's what I was trying to get across. [00:30:46] Daryl Cagle: And that's also, uh, you know, probably the top topic that editors want is, healthcare for their elderly audience that's mostly interested in that. So of course editors are gonna want this. Yeah, I get it. [00:31:00] Okay. This cartoon. Is Lena de Hyena, and I put this in here because you have such a famous cartoonist father, and this is one of the most famous cartoons ever. I wonder if you could tell us a little bit about this. This is known as the ugliest girl in the world. Um, and, uh, give us, give us some history on this. [00:31:23] Monte Wolverton: In, in 19 46, my dad had been working in, in, uh, been working in comic books for, for years. So he was an established, comic book, cartoonist. But, uh, he entered, uh, this contest, the Lena, the hyena contest was devised by L lcap, uh, in, in his strip Little Abner and. The sequence, uh, of events leading up to it was, uh, this was supposed to be lower Slovs, uh, fictitious country of lower slovs, ugliest, uh, lady. [00:32:00] and, uh, they wouldn't show her face and they wouldn't show her face. So they had a contest. They ran a contest, where various artists submitted ideas of, uh, about what, uh, Lena looked like. [00:32:11] Daryl Cagle: I should add that at this time, Al Cap was drawing the Labner and, lead in the Hyena was popular character that you never saw in Little Abner, and Little Abner was just crazy popular. This was like a, uh, on the top rung of American popular cultural stuff. so this was a, this was a contest that captivated the nation. This was a big deal, [00:32:33] Monte Wolverton: and the judges of the contest were no less than Boris Karloff, Salvador d. And Frank Sinatra I told someone that and they said, no, I don't believe it. I said, no. I have a New York Times article here that says that. And they said, well, if the New York Times said it, I believe it then. So that's back when people believed those things. [00:33:00] Uh, and anyway, he, he won first prize. He got a lot of, uh, a lot of publicity over this. Uh, it was published in Life Magazine. He ran some other features in Mag Mad Magazine, and his, his career took a turn from, uh, from regular comic books to sort sort of a more illustrative thing, caricatures and this, this type of, uh, this type of work at that time in the, in the late forties and, and the early 50. Um, the prize for, [00:33:32] Daryl Cagle: they must have gotten tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of entries to this contest because, uh, little Abner was, don't ubiquitous. [00:33:42] Monte Wolverton: Uh, Jack Davis submitted an entry. He submitted I think three entries. Uh, and he's, he's a, he's a big name. There were several, several big names that submitted entries. I would like to see his entries, but I don't, he, he threw 'em away. I guess I asked him once. . [00:34:00] So, uh, but my, but the prize was 500 bucks. And, uh, and my father got several, several hundred fan letters from it, and he answered every one of them. It took him more time to answer the fan letters than to do the, the cartoon. But he, but he did that because that was kind of a guy he was. So, anyway, [00:34:20] Daryl Cagle: well this made a, made a career for him and it's what, uh, launched him into mad. It [00:34:26] Monte Wolverton: did. Yes. And he did. There's a cover of MAD number 11, which is similar to this, and some people think it's Lena, but it's not. Lena, look up mad number 11, you'll see the difference. [00:34:37] Daryl Cagle: I do remember that. And that's also, uh, very famous. [00:34:41] Monte Wolverton: Well, so there we go. [00:34:43] Daryl Cagle: I just want to reiterate that. Monty is, uh doing, uh, crowdfunding on our site and it's at, Cagle.com/wolverton. And, as our clients die off, we want to see if we can [00:35:00] ask the fans to support the cartoonists that they love. And, and Monty is, a great cartoonist for so many years, and he's really established his, uh, I wanna say unique style, but you look so much like your dad, uh, , and, uh, he's, uh, . He, he's great. And he's [00:35:20] Monte Wolverton: got, he, he's sort of the family company, uh, kind of thing, you know? Oh, [00:35:24] Daryl Cagle: yeah. Yeah. I just, uh, I want the cartoonist to draw stronger cartoons and, uh, we wanted to lead off on cartoonist crowdfunding with Monty because, Uh, he is very much on the left and he draws very strong cartoons and he's very unique and I think that he's someone that should have, a supportive fan base and someone that I would really hate to lose from editorial cartooning. And we want to keep him drawing and we really appreciate your support [00:36:00] at Cagle.com/wolverton. And, uh, , Monty, tell us some more. [00:36:07] Monte Wolverton: Well, at times this has been a, a challenging, uh, profession. It has never been really enough to make a full-time job out of. You have to. Come up with, uh, a certain number of cartoons every week, whether you feel like it or not, and Darryl knows what this is like as, as well as all my colleagues. You might be having other problems. You might be having, all sorts of family problems and deaths and illnesses and stuff, but you still have to go to the drawing board or the computer. And come up with something that's interesting and is, is cogent and is, is, uh, accurate and newsworthy. I don't wanna say it takes a lot out of you actually. I, I find it energizing. But I think, I think the challenging part is that, is that you have to do that no [00:37:00] matter how you. and, uh, I heard that, somewhere I heard that that's a difference between a professional and an amateur as a professional comes through with something, whereas the amateur, you know, can do it if he wants to, or, or she, can take it or leave it, which is fine. It's fine because by definition amateur is something to love, but the professional has to come through with us. , every day or however often. So that's the difference. That's, that's my observation on the on that, those type of, of, uh, businesses and editorial cartooning in, in particular. [00:37:35] Daryl Cagle: Well, we love you, Monty, and, uh, we want you to keep drawing. Don't ever quit , and, uh, be as hard hitting as you want, even if we can't get the newspapers to. [00:37:46] Monte Wolverton: Okay. I'll continue to do that. . In fact, I think I have a, I think, I think I'm late on the, on the, uh, on the next car too, aren't I? Oh, [00:37:54] Daryl Cagle: you're always late, Monty, so, oh, thank you. Uh, thank you so much for, uh, being [00:38:00] with us and being with Monty. And, uh, everyone, please remember to subscribe to Cagle Cas. Go to Caglecast.com, but wherever you're watching this, please just click the subscribe button so that you don't miss us. And, uh, we will continue to have conversations with, uh, wonderful. Great, top pros like Monty. And please do go to. Cagle.com/wolverton and, uh, you can read some more from Monty and see an archive of all of his work. And I hope that you will, uh, choose to support Monty with, a couple bucks or whatever you want to do, and Monty will write you a nice thank you and we'll, we'll put you on our mail list and you'll get to see all of Monty's cartoons and all of our cartoons in your mailbox so that you don't ever have to think to go somewhere for it. And. Hey, uh, thank you so much for joining us and, uh, thank you Munty. [00:38:58] Monte Wolverton: Thank you Darrell. [00:39:00] It's been great fun. . [00:39:02] Daryl Cagle: Okay, that's the end, and uh, we'll see you on the next Caglecast.